Armin stop that sniffling and wipe those tears from your eyes! You're beginning to remind me of someone else I know - me!
i found some new Hattorff i never knew before, what shows me that the tree is indeed incomplete.
Have you not learned yet that the acorns rarely fall far from the tree? Those little "nuts" rolling around eventually sprout arms and legs and soon become human.
And who is in the list: Fourtheenth assembly district, 8 election district, 362 enumeration. 3RD Avenue House Number 115 George E. Hattorf and in another apartement Elisha van Brunt.
Well at least you found him in one source! Does the age line up suitably? If so you are making SOME progress at least. You probably should attempt to access the CITY DIRECTORIES for NYC [Manhattan] for that period. They may spell out more (sometimes a lot more).
Looks like another family is living in his apartement. And now i cant find him in the index. Is he one of those forgotten people, so will i ever see him and his wife and the name of his children ??? This is not fair really not fair i am so sad now.
Forget the fairness factor. Nothing else in life is, so why should this be an exception?!
The only chance seems to be to find him in the 1885 New York Census, but this one is of course not only so i will need a researcher in New York.
As Phyllis pointed out with that handy referral page, there is no NY state census to fill the void unfortunately. State censuses are often difficult to go through anyway, as few have been indexed so far (whether it be for NY or elsewhere). Big cities therefore present LARGE searches. Your next best options : additional voter registers and the NYC city directories.
In the UK we have to register every year to be on the voters list. If this is true for the USA then we know he was in NY 1879 at least.
The key thing here is not the stated YEAR of the voter registration, but the actual date in which the voter applicant registered for it. This could be as early as a year or two before, or even longer if "carry-overs" were allowed (I have seen such things lots of times, in addition to spurious [improper] registrations later disqualified).
And he is not in 1860, 1870, 1880 always on a Europe trip. I think he is so hard misspelled that noone can find him or he was moving around in New York, so he was just leaving as the enumerator came or ???
So many possibilities indeed. To name a few of the most obvious: he was out of town at the time of the enumeration (on a business trip, or visiting friends or relatives); he moved out of the area recently (perhaps only temporarily); he was simply missed by the census taker (either due to sloppy procedures, or the house/farm was remote enough that it was overlooked - sometimes purposely by "fast freddy" enumerators); he (the occupant(s)) was avoiding the census taker BY DESIGN (for reasons now unknown); he was enumerated but is now "missing" because of a misspelling in the index. The possibilities go on from there, but in the end we really have to consider ourselves LUCKY that so many do show up as they are 'supposed to', both in the original pages and the later compiled indexes, as there are so many ways they might not make them.
A US-Citizen? Perhaps Candada? Why not? Some of the Hattorf family have been going to Canada.
Not a common occurrence, but these things did occur sometimes. Some folks did relocate to Canada from the US in the 19th century (I've seen it before), but much more commonly to other US cities or states. Remember, people looking for new opportunities could move great distances only to return to their earlier/original towns or cities years later.
As for heading back to Germany, another possibility, but it goes without saying that most who did this were those who could afford to. That means maybe 5-7% of the immigrant population at best back then (not much different for the American populace in general either), and of that percentage not many would have, as most would have needed more compelling reasons since "vacations across the seas" were not regular occurrences in those days. Some exceptions did occur with those of lesser means, and some of the better off did take such excursions, only it was by no means commonplace prior to the 20th century for most.
Well the question is, why is he NOT in the 1880 census [?].
Answered up above. The next best thing to look for when one runs into these deficits, that is after trying all census search avenues, is alternative records to fill the gaps. Would be so much handier if you were in NYC naturally. Or act on a few of Phyllis's "end-around" suggestions.
I have tried it hundred times easily and Jennie and George junior and August nothing at all.
This is a point I allude to regularly: there is rarely gain without some pain! You have to get used to it in these kinds of pursuits. So repeat after me: DAY BY DAY AND IN EVERY WAY IT'S GETTING BETTER AND BETTER! Now go grab a beer or martini and toast your success so far.
Same procedure with his 3 boys in 1910, 1920 and 1930 this is not normal.
Normal? NORMAL! Piecing together all these scraps and tidbits from the past is not normal, our own ancestors would be the first to tell us. They do not owe us any sympathy or lending hand when it comes to making our efforts any the easier. In fact I can hear their voices chiming in unison: YOU ALL HAVE TOO MUCH TIME ON YOUR HANDS! NOW PLEASE, GET BACK TO WORK!! Call it our blessings indeed.
The only thing i can still do is 1880 Census New York, Greater New York and then turning around each and every page ....
Sometimes this is the only way. And even here, after all the work, there is no guarantee of success. Only a small taste of pain-for-gain. You might want to have your wife grab the scissors and trimmers, as she may need to tidy up your growing beard while you're at it. Nothing like spending an entire day or more scratching and clawing your way through the census pages like a depraved animal while your brain sings "la la la la la" only to discover you are no further at midnight that your were at 8AM :: not a thing found! Ah only infinitely wiser for it. Plonk! Sleep well my son, the discovery may come to you yet in your dreams. lol
Barbie's suggestion to search by looking for associative neighbors and/or relatives is one of those smart tricks that often pays off, though it requires extra work. Fortunately this approach is more accessible than ever today with computer searching, as opposed to the days when you brought along toothpicks for your eyelids to keep them propped during those excruciating sessions of plowing thru microfilmed pages ad nauseum. I can still vividly recall days where my eyes and brain went into dream-like states from the effort. LOL.
Many newer to this sport have no idea how far we have come with our tools and online implements today, or what it was like just 20-25 years ago going through things like the census records manually in the days before indexes were commonplace (and YES, that WAS after hiking uphill for hours through hail and blizzards, barefoot and hungry throughout! grrrr).
Keep chipping away my friend. You know it wouldn't be as much fun if there weren't some heady challenges lining the way, and if those "black holes" didn't keep drawing us back into what seems like dark voids. If I had a dollar for every "if only" or "why oh why" or "nothing yet!" or "how can THAT be?", I'd be on extended leave right now with Karl on Kauai, sipping an oversized Mai Tai as the rest of you grind and peck away. Only once the suntan faded and the fun was over, I'd be right back where it all began, looking through those dusty ledgers and often fuzzy films and asking "How can THAT be!??"
PS. Re Haste, Kreis Schaumburg, the locale does not look well covered in the online FHLC, but Schaumburg-Lippe (+ Grafschaft Schaumburg) are. Go here and click PLACE SEARCH button:
Type in 'Schaumburg' in the place box (ignore the optional box) and look around. Keep your eyes open for VIEW FILM NOTES in upper right corners as you proceed, as they spell out additional info. Much of this will be a mix of both English and German.